NR2003 AI edits / observations

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thunderbolt

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Jan 31, 2017
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So, I spent a month or so editing a bunch of tracks for my season. The goal was to edit so I could run with 100% AI and edits were to ensure I could be competitive.
In test sessions, I could achieve top 10 status as far as laptimes / speeds were concerned. A couple tracks caused me some extra effort but overall I was pleased with results.
So, I started up my seasons for Cup 2019, and NXS 2020. I have my own schedule but it is loosely based on the 2016 Cup schedule. I'm running @ 30% race length which means there will be at least 1 pitstop per race. These are single races and I use the online scoring system found here ... https://nr2k3.weebly.com/scoring.html
So far I'm maybe 10 races in to each series, and it is tough to win I can tell you. So far I have 1 win in Cup at California and 1 win in the NXS at Daytona.
The result of my edits seems to result in my qualifying efforts are much better and I've had a number of pole starts. However, the 100% AI are very aggressive and added to the cold tires anomaly of NR2003, means my race results have been less than spectacular.

As a comparitive, I decided to start a 3rd season using the MENCS17 mod and the ingame championship mode (same track schedule) running at 30% length but 97% AI.
Again, I find my qualifying efforts are good, but winning is still pretty tough. Having a fast car is nowhere near enough to actually win.

I will update more as I go, but I guess my overall comment is, it is not worth the effort to attempt these races at 100%. 97-98 % seems to be the correct range for a competitive race experience and still have a reasonable shot at actually winning.
 
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J.R. Franklin

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1 win out of 10 starts seems to be pretty realistic to me. It's hard to win in real life NASCAR. However, it seems that at 97-98% you feel as though you're a little more competitive and not as much of a grind. It's still tough, but not discouraging. Thus it makes it a little more fun to run a season.... and in the end, isn't that what it's all about? Having more fun and feeling like you're got a chance?
 

thunderbolt

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Jan 31, 2017
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1 win out of 10 starts seems to be pretty realistic to me. It's hard to win in real life NASCAR. However, it seems that at 97-98% you feel as though you're a little more competitive and not as much of a grind. It's still tough, but not discouraging. Thus it makes it a little more fun to run a season.... and in the end, isn't that what it's all about? Having more fun and feeling like you're got a chance?
Yeah 1 win in 10 sounds good. The trouble is I'm either running with the top 5 or getting my butt kicked. When I start on the pole (frequently it seems) it is actually a tougher race because I typically get run over and might settle in mid pack if I'm lucky and don't get spun out by the dumb AI.

Here'a peek at my 2019 Cup season so far. The 127 is me and the 128 and 129 are my fictional teammates - ratings copied from the #4.
Although my finish at Richmond doesn't reflect it, I was actually running well here but got caught in a pitroad penalty late in the race and had to go to the end of the line. I ran out of laps. The races I started on the pole, I get pushed around and practically run off the track and then I have to work my way back up through the field once my tires kick in.
Nascar Cup Series 2019 carset
AI @ 100%
RaceTrackversionlapsqualifypolepole winnerStartFinishWinnerTeam
1Daytona2020 BBMC Day60180.796185.617#414216#18JGR
2Atlanta2014 Day82197.148197.148#127132#129TBM
3Las VegasSBP 07 Day81191.422191.422#127116#2Penske
4PhoenixISM 2011110137.426137.426#127141#11JGR
5CaliforniaAutoclub 201475188.996188.996#12711#127TBM
6MartinsvilleRR 0912593.02093.020#127137#22Penske
7TexasSBP 0781197.839197.839#127135#128TBM
8BristolFSE120132.633134.210#1291842#129TBM
9RichmondBBMC nite100132.672132.672#127140#4SHR
10Talladega2014 Day66189.940189.940#127116#11JGR
 

thunderbolt

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Jan 31, 2017
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As a comparison here's my Xfinity series so far. finishes are better so perhaps the lower horsepower is better suited to my driving style.
Also, I only have 1 pole start so I actually finish better when I'm not P1 starting position.


Nascar Xfinity Series 2020 carset
AI @ 100%
RaceTrackversionlapsqualifypolepole winnerStartFinishWinnerTeam
1DaytonaBBMC day60
185.296​
186.819​
#7121#127TBM
2AtlantaSBP82
193.198​
194.097​
#38416#7
3Las VegasSBP 0781
192.438​
192.438​
#12718#22Penske
4PhoenixBBMC ISM 2019110
146.255​
146.917​
#128635#128TBM
5CaliforniaRR 0975
184.796​
185.596​
#5165#7
6TexasSBP 0784
194.665​
195.589​
#7416#7
7BristolPapyrus125
122.529​
125.889​
#72533#51
8RichmondBBMC100
130.890​
132.321​
#22735#7
9Talladega2014 Day66
181.908​
183.404​
#71114#9
10DoverSBP 07120
161.885​
162.053​
#1437#38
 
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thunderbolt

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Here's some more season results. This one is my MENCS17 series running @ 97% AI. Overall results are better but still no cake walk to get a win or top 5.
My California race was a little frustrating as I was running 5th with 15 laps to go when I had to pause the race to take a phone call. When I resumed the race, my focus was off and I spun out on the next turn. No damage but I lost a lot of track position. So still looking for my first win.

I have also now created a 4th season using the BRSC13 mod and SBR-HR carset for 2013. AI is set to 98%.
This one will be interesting because I have chosen to use all original Papyrus tracks and applied my personal edits. My thoughts is the AI race etiquette may prove to be a little better and the racing; while still competitive, will be less bumpin' and bangin'. So far test results on the tracks have shown this to be true.

Nascar Cup Series 2017 carset
AI @ 97%
RaceTrackversionlapsqualifypolepole winnerStartFinishWinnerTeam
1Daytona60115#78FRM
2Atlanta81123#78FRM
3Las Vegas82124#18JGR
4ArizonaSpwy 2009811428#11JGR
5California60128#78FRM
 

Blaise

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I've been doing the same thing. Getting all the tracks setup so I have a "chance" at a top 10. I've been messing with the papy_ai.ini but only the line "cold_tire_coeff = 1.00" to try and fix the AI cold tire thing. I've ran 20test races and I don't see a difference with any number combination. I'm going to mess with the "tire_temp_increment = 0.0025 ; increment for tire warmup waypoint" and it seems to help but too soon to tell. These are the only changes I've made to papy_ai though.
 

thunderbolt

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Jan 31, 2017
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I've been doing the same thing. Getting all the tracks setup so I have a "chance" at a top 10. I've been messing with the papy_ai.ini but only the line "cold_tire_coeff = 1.00" to try and fix the AI cold tire thing. I've ran 20test races and I don't see a difference with any number combination. I'm going to mess with the "tire_temp_increment = 0.0025 ; increment for tire warmup waypoint" and it seems to help but too soon to tell. These are the only changes I've made to papy_ai though.
Hmmm I haven't looked at the Papy AI file. I'll take a peek. Let me know if you hit on something that works.
 

J.R. Franklin

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I've been doing the same thing. Getting all the tracks setup so I have a "chance" at a top 10. I've been messing with the papy_ai.ini but only the line "cold_tire_coeff = 1.00" to try and fix the AI cold tire thing. I've ran 20test races and I don't see a difference with any number combination. I'm going to mess with the "tire_temp_increment = 0.0025 ; increment for tire warmup waypoint" and it seems to help but too soon to tell. These are the only changes I've made to papy_ai though.
Hey Blaise. Many years ago a guy (darned if I can remember his name) did a deep dive into trying to figure out how to solve the cold tire disadvantage that the Player has against the A.I.. He played with that "cold_tire_coeff = 100 setting until he was blue in the face, but could not find anything that would solve or help reduce that disadvantage. The problem has got to be in some other setting that none of us have figured out as of yet. Anyway, I just thought that I'd let you know that someone has tried and failed at it before after spending a considerable amount of time on it. I don't mean to discourage you from trying.... just sayin'. ;)
 
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JNorton (WKC)

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track ini. / ai_accel_modifier = 0.63, did the trick for me. No more getting swamped during restarts.

Yeah I hated that about the original Papy tracks. The green would drop and the AI would just run away from you. Lowering the ai_accel_modifier is the perfect way to fix that issue and even out the playing field on starts and restarts.
 

thunderbolt

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Jan 31, 2017
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Thanks for the feedback guys...appreciate.
A little update:
I continue to run the NXS20 series @ 100%. I seem to be able to hold my own in this series at this level and in fact went out and won the Charlotte race using the Lowes_SBP06_Day track.
My NCS19 series I ran another race at100%. this time at Dover with similar results as before. My speeds are fine and I have no trouble keeping up but on starts and restarts the AI is just too aggressive and run me off the track. Result is a very poor finish.

So for the next race at Kansas, I lowered the AI to 98%. All other settings as I had edited previously. This resulted in a win for me. It was still not a "gimme" as I had to battle against the #18 and the #11 who gave me a run. I did lap quite a number of the competitors and had to be cautious and pick my spot to make the pass on them to avoid disaster. Patience is still very much the name of the game in order to win.
A little luck never hurts either. I decided to pit on lap 45 of an 81 laps race; go a lap down and then ride out the pit cycle to regain the lead.

Now, as to my other 2 series I'm running.
MENCS17 is being run thru the ingame championship mode @ 97% AI. Same tracks as my NCS19 series. So far finishes in the 20's and 1 top 5.

I started a 4th series using the BRSC13 mod and running @ 98% using all original Papyrus tracks. (exception here are 2 sub tracks I use in place of the roadies) Edits made match edits I did to the other tracks. My logic being just maybe the original Papy AI are a little more "courteous" and hopefully will race me cleaner. We'll see. So far I've only run Daytona and no I did not win. Next race on my schedule is Atlanta.

As another interesting tidbit, I have 2 basic paint schemes (done in various color combinations) and both my NXS20 wins came in the FS1 scheme.
First one is the wining car from Charlotte race. 2nd car shown won at Daytona.
NXS20M27Ct_FS1_CoorsHav_SYR.PNG
NXS20M27C_FS1_CoorsGradSilverRed_Front_Left.PNG
My 2 NCS19 wins both came in my FS2 scheme. The black. red. yellow version won at Kansas.
FS2TexHavBlackRedYellow.png

This version won at California.
ME21aM27C_FS2_CoorsDrkBluSilverRed_TMS.png
 

thunderbolt

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Jan 31, 2017
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Season updates:
I continue to run the NCS19 series @ 98% AI after the disasters of trying to run @ 100%.
I seem to be doing the "Ricky Bobby thing here. If I'm not first, I'm last LOL
Update to my NCS19 Cup series. Next race up is Chicagoland.

RaceTrackversionlapsqualifypolepole winnerStartFinishWinnerTeamManufacturer

11DoverSBP120169.237169.237#127142#19JGRToyota
remaining races run @ 98%
12KansasSBP81186.284186.284#12711#127TBMFord
13CharlotteSBP120188.337188.337#127140#128TBMFord
14PoconoFSE 201260168.366172.805#113340#4SHRFord
15MichiganFSE 201280202.823202.823#12711#127TBMFord

My NXS20 season is going ok. I still run it @ 100% AI and overall results are ok. Some races end in disaster; others I do well.
Pitstops sometimes bite me; other races it works out as planned.

I have to give a shoutout to the guys @ FSE for building the Iowa track. This race was one of the best I've ever run. I took the pole and held off the pack for 30 laps. During a restart I got spun out bringing out the 2nd caution. I decide to pit and came back out in 29th; last car on the lead lap. Worked my way thru the field a little at a time. The AI raced me clean and I continued forward till I was in 6th. Another yellow with 12 laps to go. I continued to move forward and was running 2nd when yet another caution flag came out. I had to race back to the line and passed the first place car just as we crossed the line. The race ended under yellow and I got the win. It is the first time I've ever raced this track and I'm definitely looking forward to the next one as it comes back up on the schedule a little later on.

RaceTrackversionlapsqualifypolepole winnerStartFinishWinnerTeamManufacturer

8RichmondBBMC100
130.890​
132.321​
#22735#7Chev
9Talladega2014 Day66
181.908​
183.404​
#71114#9Chev
10DoverSBP 07120
161.885​
162.053​
#1437#38Ford
11CharlotteSBP82
185.772​
185.772​
#12711#127TBMFord
12PoconoFSE 201260
169.119​
167.692​
#771#127TBMFord
13MichiganFSE 201280
194.906​
194.906​
#127137#7Chev
14IowaFSE100
138.963​
138.963​
#12711#127TBMFord
 

thunderbolt

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Jan 31, 2017
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More updates for my 2 seasons. Got my first ever Cup win at New Hampshire so pretty pleased about that. Daytona results were disappointing.

Poles =17Chev1TBM9
Nascar Cup Series 2019 carsetWins =6Ford15JGR5
R1 > R11AI @ 100%Top 5 =6Toyota4Penske2
R12 > R36AI @ 98%Top 10 =6SHR3
RaceTrackversionlapsqualifypolepole winnerStartFinishWinnerTeamManufacturer
16Atlanta2014 Nite114192.007192.007#12711#127TBMFord1
17ChicagoRR09 Beta107189.155189.155#127111#4SHRFord1
18DaytonaBBMC nite64189.155189.155#127132#9HMSChev
19KentuckyDtN SDT107185.899185.899#12711#127TBMFord1
20New HampshireRF 2013120134.411134.411#12711#127TBMFord1
 

thunderbolt

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Jan 31, 2017
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I continue to have good results in my NXS20 season @ 100% AI.
2nd round at Iowa was not as successful as first but still an enjoyable track to run at.


RaceTrackversionlapsqualifypolepole winnerStartFinishWinnerTeamManufacturer
15ChicagolandRR Beta107
188.706​
188.706​
#12711#127TBMFord
16DaytonaBBMC Night64
177.831​
178.197​
#721#127TBMFord
17KentuckyDtN SDT107
178.755​
180.271​
#767#51Chev
18New HampshireRR 09100
134.406​
134.406​
#12711#127TBMFord
19IowaFSE199
138.699​
138.699​
#127126#1Chev
 

thunderbolt

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Jan 31, 2017
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Just finished an Xfinity race at a track called Houston DX. here's a link to a modified version of the track I'm talking about http://www.mediafire.com/file/51f6en6a0ks4bal/cynon_dx_houston.rar/file
First time for a full race here. I use it as an alternate track.
Ran 110 laps. good fun. Sort of looks like Kentucky but races more like Darlington. Gotta whoa 'er down for turns 1 & 2 but you can pretty much put pedal to the metal in 3 /4.
I started 3rd; finished 14th. I was in 24th spot after pitstops at lap 55, and had to work my way through the field. Was running 2nd when the final caution came out.
On a green / white / checker finish I started to lose power as I was low on fuel and held on for 14th.

If you've never raced this track, I recommend it as a fun track to run. My car was not the best out there, so I was surprised I was doing as well as I did.
Watch your tire wear; that 1/2 turn will tear 'em up if you're too aggressive.
 
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